I'm Tired Of These Ungrateful Hurricane Victims

[AguaGirl]

Apparently the one where all local construction is run by the US
government... (a scary world, huh?)

Does anyone else find it ironic that the mayor of NO complained
that the government didn't do enough to help? Wouldn't that have
been his job...to have a good plan in case the predicted happened?

I have to admit he did a great job of deflecting criticism. I live in
So Cal and if my city was devasted by an earthquake and there wasn't
a plan in place to react I would be angry with my mayor first, my
governor second and the feds only if they didn't show up within a
week or two. I may never live to see the "big one" but living on
an earthquake fault, in a coastal city that's below sea level or in
tornado alley should prompt us (me, local and state govt) to have a plan.

AG

 

[Bill Sornson]

Does anyone else find it ironic that the mayor of NO complained
that the government didn't do enough to help? Wouldn't that have
been his job...to have a good plan in case the predicted happened?

I have to admit he did a great job of deflecting criticism. I live in
So Cal and if my city was devasted by an earthquake and there wasn't
a plan in place to react I would be angry with my mayor first, my
governor second and the feds only if they didn't show up within a
week or two. I may never live to see the "big one" but living on
an earthquake fault, in a coastal city that's below sea level or in
tornado alley should prompt us (me, local and state govt) to have a
plan.

Marry me.

 

[Hillcrest]

Unfortunately, you have never been thru a Hurricane and the terrible
aftermath, where you have to make an effort to organize your
traumatized life.

Everytime a storm hits, you remember. Everytime you hear thunder, you
remember. And every time it rains hard, you remember, what you went
thru. You never forget.

So, you should be counting your lucky stars, instead of critizing those
who "survived".

Phyllis

 

[bigjim]

I'm too smart to live in an area prone to hurricanes tornadoes
earthquakes, tsunamis, glaciers, volcanoes,

 

[Mike Kruger]

I'm too smart to live in an area prone to hurricanes tornadoes
earthquakes, tsunamis, glaciers, volcanoes,

or correct punctuation?

 

[Windcat]

I'm too smart to live in an area prone to hurricanes tornadoes
earthquakes, tsunamis, glaciers, volcanoes,

So all you have to worry about are hail, lightening,
meteorites,comets,asteroids,falling satellites,house fires,
ladders, bathtubs and drunks on freeways. Sleep well, my friend.

 

[Remco]

I'm too smart to live in an area prone to hurricanes tornadoes
earthquakes, tsunamis, glaciers, volcanoes,

You must live in the state of Oblivion - didn't they proclaim that to
be the 51st state recently? Or was it Ignorance?
Either way, you should run for governor as you are more than
qualified..

 

[Grolsch]

**** OFF TROLL!

 

[tr2267]

What world do you live in???

Have you forgotten all the nauseating crap about Bush we heard in the media
after 9/11 before reality set in? "Bush is a strong leader...blah blah...
Bush is bold and resolute...blah blah...Bush is strong and resolute...
It is preposterous to think the same President who is deaf about the response
to invading Iraq would care one damn bit about someone not wanting to send
troops to New Orleans, even more so when you realize there are tens of
millions of Americans who opposed Iraq and absolutely no one who opposed
federal troops in New Orleans.

 

[tr2267]

I have to admit he did a great job of deflecting criticism. I live in
So Cal

I live in Texas where half the refugees went and it was fucking unbelievable
that there was no national plan for the refugees. My state's politicians
were scrambling all over and contacting other states to find locations for
everyone. Refugees showing up at the Astrodome on their own were being
turned away because the city didn't think there would be enough room for
everybody. Any American President who wasn't a complete shit-for-brains
would have coordinated the flow of refugees at the national level and
asked every city and town in the 48 states how much estimated space they
had available. The disaster was an "Incident of NATIONAL Signficance".

and if my city was devasted by an earthquake and there wasn't

An earthquake does not make an entire city uninhabitable. The only
real comparison to New Orleans would be a nuclear bomb.

a plan in place to react I would be angry with my mayor first, my
governor second and the feds only if they didn't show up within a
week or two.

If nuclear radiation made your entire major city unsafe and uninhabitable
you wouldn't care if the President thinks it is more important to fly off
to give a speech about Iraq?

I may never live to see the "big one" but living on
an earthquake fault, in a coastal city that's below sea level or in
tornado alley should prompt us (me, local and state govt) to have a plan.

Therefore it is just fine for the federal government to not have any plans
to deal with major disasters four years after 9/11/2001? Katrina was as
much of a weapon of mass destruction as anything is. The entire point of
America having an "Office of Homeland Security" and "Federal Emergency
Management Agency" is to prepare for these things.

 

[TheBaseBallBravesMan]

Maybe being called refugees kinda makes them angry. They are American
Citizens. If a person does not own a house and rents are they refugees.

 

[George Leppla]

I live in Texas where half the refugees went and it was fucking
unbelievable
that there was no national plan for the refugees.

We do have a national plan and an agency to oversee and implement it. It is
the Department of Homeland Security. It is also now our newest national
joke.

Texas has been doing a wonderful job of taking in the refugees. I saw an
interview with the Mayor of Houston and the reporter asked him how his city
was going to pay for everything they have been doing. He never
hesitated...... he just said that at a time like this, the only important
thing was helping the people. He would worry about the money later. I
don't know if he is a Republican or Democrat or if he is even a good Mayor,
but he did the right thing in this case. Too bad more of our politicians
aren't like him.

And yes, I call them refugees. Evacuees are displaced due to a natural
disaster. Refugees are displaced because of war or political reasons. The
hurricane made them evacuees. The government's inability to serve, protect
and provide for our citizens made them refugees. ALL levels of
government.... local, state and federal failed in their job.

Government derives it's power and authority from the people, not the other
way around. Sooner or later we ought to wake up our elected officials so
that they take care of the people in THIS country first.


--
George in PA http://www.countryside-travel.com

The Mother of All Group Cruises 2 - http://www.moagc2.com/
May 20, 2006, Caribbean Princess - http://cruisemaster.com/caribprin.htm
October 29, 2006 - SLEAZY 4! http://cruisemaster.com/sleazy4.htm

 

[Lloyd Parsons]

I'm too smart to live in an area prone to hurricanes tornadoes
earthquakes, tsunamis, glaciers, volcanoes,

Yeah, but living in a cave has its own issues.... ;-)

 

[Mark Hickey]

I live in Texas where half the refugees went and it was fucking unbelievable
that there was no national plan for the refugees.

Like there was someplace to move them within the US that wasn't within
a STATE?

My state's politicians
were scrambling all over and contacting other states to find locations for
everyone. Refugees showing up at the Astrodome on their own were being
turned away because the city didn't think there would be enough room for
everybody. Any American President who wasn't a complete shit-for-brains
would have coordinated the flow of refugees at the national level and
asked every city and town in the 48 states how much estimated space they
had available.

You guys don't expect much out of the POTUS, do you? First, he should
be able to discern buried facts in intelligence reports that escaped
the FBI, CIA and military intelligence - now he's supposed to
personally oversee disaster recovery and relocation efforts. Thing
is, you are also blasting those whose job it is to do so for having
"too little experience", but would turn the job over to someone who's
never done it.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

 

[The Wogster]

I live in Texas where half the refugees went and it was fucking unbelievable
that there was no national plan for the refugees. My state's politicians
were scrambling all over and contacting other states to find locations for
everyone. Refugees showing up at the Astrodome on their own were being
turned away because the city didn't think there would be enough room for
everybody. Any American President who wasn't a complete shit-for-brains
would have coordinated the flow of refugees at the national level and
asked every city and town in the 48 states how much estimated space they
had available. The disaster was an "Incident of NATIONAL Signficance".

Actually it's a tragedy of errors, most of them local.

* NOLA was built essentially on a sand bar surrounded by salt water
marsh. They built a wall out of earth, drained the middle, and built a
city in the hole, considering that it's in hurricane territory, this
should be considered a "real bad idea".

* NOLA knowing that maintenance of the walls wasn't happening, didn't
take proper action, it's not the wall around the feds that's leaking.
It's often easier to go begging for specific money amounts, for example
-- we are fixing the walls, we need $60 million, the city is putting up
$20 million, we would like $20 million from the state, and $20 million
from the feds. They most likely would have gotten it.

* The NOLA mayor should have had a plan other then to yell "run for the
hills, every man for him self, as he climbed into his limo to leave"...

Your assuming that POTUS knows with intent detail exactly what is going
on in every town in the country, he can't. He needs to deal with what
are important issues, and until the dust er water settled in NOLA, it
wasn't even on his agenda, except as maybe a FYI. Considering Florida,
which had at least 3 cat 4 hurricanes cross the state last year, without
needing the feds to take over, it would be a small item indeed, until
after the fact. Hind sight is always 20/20.

An earthquake does not make an entire city uninhabitable. The only
real comparison to New Orleans would be a nuclear bomb.




If nuclear radiation made your entire major city unsafe and uninhabitable
you wouldn't care if the President thinks it is more important to fly off
to give a speech about Iraq?

I would assume that the President, or in my case Prime Minister, has
more on his daily agenda then to wait for the city mayor and provincial
premier to screw up.

Therefore it is just fine for the federal government to not have any plans
to deal with major disasters four years after 9/11/2001? Katrina was as
much of a weapon of mass destruction as anything is. The entire point of
America having an "Office of Homeland Security" and "Federal Emergency
Management Agency" is to prepare for these things.

Again it really comes down to not expecting that the city and state
couldn't get their acts together, especially when Florida dealt with 3
of them last year, and didn't need federal hand holding, for any of them.

W

 

[AguaGirl]

I live in Texas where half the refugees went and it was fucking unbelievable
that there was no national plan for the refugees.

Your right, there should be a federal plan to house the homeless including
victims of disasters(which is what these people are...they would only be
refugees
only if they were coming from outside the US). I blame every single sitting
president, congressman and senator since WWI. It's not a Bush thing..it's
a US thing. We don't plan for the unthinkable and neither do our elected
leaders.

My state's politicians
were scrambling all over and contacting other states to find locations for
everyone. Refugees showing up at the Astrodome on their own were being
turned away because the city didn't think there would be enough room for
everybody. Any American President who wasn't a complete shit-for-brains
would have coordinated the flow of refugees at the national level and
asked every city and town in the 48 states how much estimated space they
had available. The disaster was an "Incident of NATIONAL Signficance".

Someone hand me a map...is Texas close to New Orleans? ;-). You do
realize that all the states are offering some form of housing. The problem
is logistical. You first move everyone out of harms way and then you
worry about a more permanent solution. There are already people in
So Cal who were displaced, I expect we will see more in the coming
weeks as will a lot of other states.

An earthquake does not make an entire city uninhabitable. The only
real comparison to New Orleans would be a nuclear bomb.

You obviously don't know much about earthquakes or nuclear bombs.
They expect NO to be habitable again in a year or so....no fall out
or residual radiation. A lot of the city is still standing. Flood
damage may change that but you wouldn't even have that much
if a bomb had gone off. Earthquakes are unpredictable. There
wouldn't be any evacuation. You might want to do a little research
before you make these kinds of claims. The "big" one they predict
will eventually hit here will topple buildings, buckle roads, burst
gas and water lines causing both flooding and fires, etc. Take
new orleans, remove some water, add 50,000 people and then
knock down 15-20 of the largest buildings. tada...

If nuclear radiation made your entire major city unsafe and uninhabitable
you wouldn't care if the President thinks it is more important to fly off
to give a speech about Iraq?

Okay, now you are just being a drama queen. but for the record, I do not
expect the president to personally insure my safety any more than I want
him legislating my morals. You give the office way too much credit. He
isn't in charge of the kind of plans your asking for and he doesn't control
the money to put them in place. You would be equally if not more upset
at the mayor, govenor and all of congress if you weren't trying to
politicize
this like every other democrat. BTW...have you personally taken in anyone
that was displaced? Have you offered?

Therefore it is just fine for the federal government to not have any plans
to deal with major disasters four years after 9/11/2001? Katrina was as
much of a weapon of mass destruction as anything is. The entire point of
America having an "Office of Homeland Security" and "Federal Emergency
Management Agency" is to prepare for these things.

Wow, you must be even madder at Clinton. We have been dealing with
hurricanes for a long time and yet we never had an office of homeland
security until Bush. FEMA is the one who is supposed to prepare for these
things. FEMA is an umbrella organization. Since each and every city has
different issues, different threats and different logistics...CITIES are
supposed
to have plans in place. Yes, FEMA blew it and heads are already starting
to roll but so did the Mayor of NO and the Govenor. The feds don't look
around the country to see what's needed...the country elects representatives
to be their voice. If a better plan should have been in place than why
wasn't
the LOCAL elected officials pushing for it?

That's ok, you keep on using this tragedy as a political platform to rant
about
the current government. It doesn't change anything, doesn't help anyone but
it seems to make you feel better. Personally I am going to be pushing for
congress and FEMA to support evacuation plans that allow people to take
their pets. A lot of folks don't evacuate because they don't want to leave
them behind. I am going to push for my congress and FEMA to earmark
closed military bases as rescue centers. Have a plan to stock them and
turn the hangers into temporary living shelters..enough to support families
and their pets for two weeks in case of such a disaster. I am not going
to pretend that this would have turned out differently under any other
sitting
president. Stop politicizing it and do something constructive.

AG

 

[Bill Sornson]

Your right, there should be a federal plan to house the homeless
including victims of disasters(which is what these people are...they
would only be refugees
only if they were coming from outside the US). I blame every single
sitting president, congressman and senator since WWI. It's not a
Bush thing..it's a US thing. We don't plan for the unthinkable and
neither do our elected leaders.


Someone hand me a map...is Texas close to New Orleans? ;-). You do
realize that all the states are offering some form of housing. The
problem is logistical. You first move everyone out of harms way and
then you
worry about a more permanent solution. There are already people in
So Cal who were displaced, I expect we will see more in the coming
weeks as will a lot of other states.


You obviously don't know much about earthquakes or nuclear bombs.
They expect NO to be habitable again in a year or so....no fall out
or residual radiation. A lot of the city is still standing. Flood
damage may change that but you wouldn't even have that much
if a bomb had gone off. Earthquakes are unpredictable. There
wouldn't be any evacuation. You might want to do a little research
before you make these kinds of claims. The "big" one they predict
will eventually hit here will topple buildings, buckle roads, burst
gas and water lines causing both flooding and fires, etc. Take
new orleans, remove some water, add 50,000 people and then
knock down 15-20 of the largest buildings. tada...


Okay, now you are just being a drama queen. but for the record, I do
not expect the president to personally insure my safety any more than
I want him legislating my morals. You give the office way too much
credit. He isn't in charge of the kind of plans your asking for and
he doesn't control the money to put them in place. You would be
equally if not more upset
at the mayor, govenor and all of congress if you weren't trying to
politicize
this like every other democrat. BTW...have you personally taken in
anyone that was displaced? Have you offered?


Wow, you must be even madder at Clinton. We have been dealing with
hurricanes for a long time and yet we never had an office of homeland
security until Bush. FEMA is the one who is supposed to prepare for
these things. FEMA is an umbrella organization. Since each and
every city has different issues, different threats and different
logistics...CITIES are supposed
to have plans in place. Yes, FEMA blew it and heads are already
starting to roll but so did the Mayor of NO and the Govenor. The
feds don't look around the country to see what's needed...the country
elects representatives to be their voice. If a better plan should
have been in place than why wasn't
the LOCAL elected officials pushing for it?

That's ok, you keep on using this tragedy as a political platform to
rant about
the current government. It doesn't change anything, doesn't help
anyone but it seems to make you feel better. Personally I am going
to be pushing for congress and FEMA to support evacuation plans that
allow people to take their pets. A lot of folks don't evacuate
because they don't want to leave them behind. I am going to push for
my congress and FEMA to earmark
closed military bases as rescue centers. Have a plan to stock them
and turn the hangers into temporary living shelters..enough to
support families and their pets for two weeks in case of such a
disaster. I am not going
to pretend that this would have turned out differently under any other
sitting
president. Stop politicizing it and do something constructive.

Marry me. (Second proposal this week!)

Bill "disclaimer goes here" S.

 

[Don]

Actually it's a tragedy of errors, most of them local.

* NOLA was built essentially on a sand bar surrounded by salt water marsh.
They built a wall out of earth, drained the middle, and built a city in
the hole, considering that it's in hurricane territory, this should be
considered a "real bad idea".

* NOLA knowing that maintenance of the walls wasn't happening, didn't take
proper action, it's not the wall around the feds that's leaking. It's
often easier to go begging for specific money amounts, for example -- we
are fixing the walls, we need $60 million, the city is putting up $20
million, we would like $20 million from the state, and $20 million from
the feds. They most likely would have gotten it.

* The NOLA mayor should have had a plan other then to yell "run for the
hills, every man for him self, as he climbed into his limo to leave"...

Your assuming that POTUS knows with intent detail exactly what is going on
in every town in the country, he can't. He needs to deal with what are
important issues, and until the dust er water settled in NOLA, it wasn't
even on his agenda, except as maybe a FYI. Considering Florida, which had
at least 3 cat 4 hurricanes cross the state last year, without needing the
feds to take over, it would be a small item indeed, until after the fact.
Hind sight is always 20/20.



I would assume that the President, or in my case Prime Minister, has more
on his daily agenda then to wait for the city mayor and provincial premier
to screw up.


Again it really comes down to not expecting that the city and state
couldn't get their acts together, especially when Florida dealt with 3 of
them last year, and didn't need federal hand holding, for any of them.

W

It is interesting to note that prior to Bush, nobody expected the president
to personally develop an evacuation plan. Now that one was expected, it is
only Bush's problem and all prior presidents are excused from any
responsibility. I personally think that they should have used the
evacuation plan developed during Clinton's presidency.

Everyone who believes that an evacuation plan should have been in place and
executed without hitch is living in a dream world. An evacuation plan would
be almost impossible. First, you would have to decide when an evacuation
plan should be put into effect. This alone makes it unworkable.

What level hurricane do you require to execute a plan - Level 3, 4 or 5? Do
you have a different plan for each level? Who should the plan address?
Does it exist on the local, state or multi-state level? If you plan on a
multi-state level, who is in charge? A state, a committee, or a federal
agency? If on a State level, do you make sure that it doesn't conflict with
adjacent states? If local, who should be shot for stupidity?

When do you execute a plan? When the hurricane is 1, 2, 3, 4 or more days
out? If you execute it in advance, the cone of projection of the path is
wide and how do you know where it is going to hit? Do you evacuate east,
west or north or a combination of these? If the hurricane is headed for New
Orleans, for example, the path might be 50 miles west of the city or 50
miles east, which would definitely affect the direction of evacuation.

Most important, "Where do you evacuate people to"? You probably are only
guessing how many people that the local or state plan would require public
transportation. You would have to have a method of transporting them
immediately available. For 100,000 people, this would require more than a
handful of buses. Where would they go and how would you decide, based on
the direction of evacuation and the level of the hurricane. If a hurricane
hits west of New Orleans, the destination would be very different than if it
hits east. A truly workable plan would identify actual sites that could
take people, how many each site could take, an alternate if that site is
unavailable for some reason, a method for stocking that site with food,
water, cots, etc., well in advance of any emergency, exactly how to get
people to that site, identify support personnel for that site, ensure that
they are on location prior to the evacuation,. and probably 100 other items
that I haven't thought of.

There are probably only about 5,000 other questions that have to be answered
and most of them will conflict with each other based on resources, where the
storm hits, level of the storm and advance notice required. If truth, there
is no way that a good, valid, workable evacuation plan can be formulated.
If the Democrats had been in control in Washington, the same results would
have
happened in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast. The Republicans would be the
ones pointing fingers and blaming the Democratic president. It is all
political and there will, in the end, be nothing tangible accomplished by
all of the finger pointing and blame.

After a false alarm, who is to be shot for spending the millions and
millions (Maybe billions) that were necessary to execute the evacuation
plan. Everyone who was activated, will have to be paid for the time pulled
from their actual employment and I would bet that after a couple of false
alarms, the volunteers would be reduced.

You can't fight mother nature and you can't change human nature.

Don D

 

[Kurt Ullman]

It is interesting to note that prior to Bush, nobody expected the president
to personally develop an evacuation plan. Now that one was expected, it is
only Bush's problem and all prior presidents are excused from any
responsibility. I personally think that they should have used the
evacuation plan developed during Clinton's presidency.

Tehcnically it was. The first of the Plans on the LA Emergency
Managemenet wesbite (okay different agency name, but I am too lazy
to look it up) were dated in early 2000. There were a couple
updates, but none addressing anything of interest here, mostly
changing names of things.

 

[Bob the Cow]

I'm too smart to live in an area prone to hurricanes tornadoes
earthquakes, tsunamis, glaciers, volcanoes,

Just where is your petri dish located, then?