H6 engine v. H4 in Subaru Outback wagon

[Alan]

91 octane is suggested, not mandatory, but you lose HP with less. In my
area, you can buy 87, 89, 93, or 94, so I wind up buying 93. I get 20 mpg
city. The trannys are set to shift early, so you lose power in the low end
(but saves fuel). Goes __much__ faster if you shift manually.

 

[Mickey]

My husband and I are thinking of buying an Outback. Probably a used
2003 model. We've only gotten the chance to drive the standard H4
engine. Is it worth it to get the H6? Right now I drive a 98 Toyota
Corolla and although its a great car I hate how it takes so long to
speed up. I dont want to buy an H4 to only wish I had gone the H6
route. Does anyone have any experience with this?

Hate to Hi-jack this topic but have a question that fits in.

Have not looked at the H6 but how do they get that engine in the car? The H4
engine to very close to the radiator. Seems to me going to the 6 requires more
than just bolting in the new engine. Seems like with the longer engine, the
front diff is going to move back and then not in line with front wheels. Maybe
some of the extra $$$ is due to requirement for different differential/transmission.

Mickey

 

[Skweezieweezie]

The H6 is only about an inch or so bigger than the H4.
A timing chain was used instead of belts, saving space
up front. The H6 does weigh about 90lbs more, though.
The H6 tranny is a slightly beefed up 4EAT.
I get 26-27mpg on the highway using 92octane.

 

[Tony Hwang]

PS - the premium gas costs more but I just DON'T CARE.

Very good attitude. Dybya would love your kind.

 

[John M.]

I drove a bare-bones Corolla for 12 years before getting my H-6 two years ago.
I have found it to be invaluable here around NYC and NJ where one must be able
to accelerate quickly in many situations. I find myself confidently executing
maneuvers that I would have never dared to try in my old car because it just
didn't have enough power. Never regretted the premium model yet. And everyone
who gets in the car comments that it looks and drives like a luxury car that
costs 1.5 times as much.

This has been my experience too. I really enjoy the H-6 VDC.

 

[CompUser]

Very good attitude. Dybya would love your kind.

Tony, don't bring AGA politics in here.

Thanks!

Steve

 

[Peter Eberl]

80mph???
are you kidding?
I was cruising at 100 before I realized it..I was wondering why I was
passing Bmers and Benzes..
Good thing Smokey was somewhere else..
No speeding tickets so-far...
I have a 2002 H6 VDC Sedan in New England with 24,000 miles an NO problems

 

[Florian Feuser /FFF/]

80mph???
are you kidding?
I was cruising at 100 before I realized it..I was wondering why I was
passing Bmers and Benzes..
Good thing Smokey was somewhere else..
No speeding tickets so-far...

Yea, knock on fake wood trim!


I find the 2.5 H4 a good match for my 98 GT. Of course, that car weighs 600lbs
less and the smaller tire radius gets more effective torque....

Florian

 

[Yousuf Khan]

My husband and I are thinking of buying an Outback. Probably a used
2003 model. We've only gotten the chance to drive the standard H4
engine. Is it worth it to get the H6? Right now I drive a 98 Toyota
Corolla and although its a great car I hate how it takes so long to
speed up. I dont want to buy an H4 to only wish I had gone the H6
route. Does anyone have any experience with this?

Are you going with an automatic or manual transmission? If you're going with
the manual, then you won't have any trouble with the power of the H4. If
you're going with the automatic, then I'd get the H6. During my test drive a
couple of years ago, I had felt that the automatic just sucked the life out
of the H4 fairly quickly. I think you need the H6 with automatic just to get
back to the same level of responsiveness that you get with the H4 and
manual. Of course, the H6 is only available in automatic, so your only real
choices are: (1) manual and H4 or (2) automatic and H6. Forget about the H4
and automatic.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Have not looked at the H6 but how do they get that engine in the car?
The H4 engine to very close to the radiator. Seems to me going to
the 6 requires more than just bolting in the new engine. Seems like
with the longer engine, the
front diff is going to move back and then not in line with front
wheels. Maybe some of the extra $$$ is due to requirement for
different differential/transmission.

The H6 is just a derivation of the H4. They've fit the extra cylinders
pretty much in the space between the existing cylinders. Namely the cylinder
walls are practically touching each other and there's no cooling water
jacket in between them. Apparently the H6 isn't all that much longer than
the H4.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Particle Salad]

Well, it's probably too late to jump in here, but not everyone prefers a 6.
I bought an '03' model and chose the 4.... the fuel efficiency is a big deal
for me. I don't find the 4 lacking in power, except when it's all loaded up
cruising up in the mountains.... and even then, it really is fine.

I went in thinking Outback, by the way, and came out with a Legacy wagon...
it handled a lot better.

 

[John M.]

The H6 is just a derivation of the H4. They've fit the extra cylinders

pretty much in the space between the existing cylinders. Namely the cylinder
walls are practically touching each other and there's no cooling water
jacket in between them. Apparently the H6 isn't all that much longer than
the H4.

The H6 is *not* just a derivative of the H4. It is a new engine... and they
did *not* 'just' fit 'extra' cylinders in the space between existing
cylinders! From the technical manual:
-" The cylinder bore and piston stroke dimensions have been selected
optimally for sufficient output and reduced size of the engine; they are
89.2 mm (3.512 in) and 80 mm (3.150 in) in contrast to 99.5 mm (3.917 in)
and 79.0 mm (3.110 in) of the H4 engine."
-"The EZ-3.0 is the model name for the new 6-cylinder engine introduced for
the 2001 model year Legacy. The design idea for this engine was to create a
power plant that could utilize the current body style, provide more power
and decreased exhaust emissions. Many of the features refined for the
current 4 cylinder engine are emploed on the EZ-3.0 however, new features
such as Variable Intack Control and timing chain driven camshafts give the
new engine a look and operation all of its own."

Please check your opinions before posting them as facts.
John

 

[PeterD]

Have you tried taking both for a test drive?

 

[Todd H.]

My husband and I are thinking of buying an Outback. Probably a used
2003 model. We've only gotten the chance to drive the standard H4
engine. Is it worth it to get the H6? Right now I drive a 98 Toyota
Corolla and although its a great car I hate how it takes so long to
speed up. I dont want to buy an H4 to only wish I had gone the H6
route. Does anyone have any experience with this?

Well, the H6 is mighty peppier. The h4 in a car of the Outback's
weight won't dazzle anyone with acceleration, but it's not horrible.

The downsides to the H6 appear to be a bit of an issue with
reliability apparently--someone mentioned it's actually on a list of
cars to avoid list somewhere. And also, the cost since the H6 is
only available in the tpo of the line models (LL Bean and the VDC I
think).

Late model Subarus are one hell of a rarety on the used market,
though. At least they were in this tiny town of Chicagoland when I
was looking a couple years ago. As such, I don't imagine you'll have
the luxury of being too picky. I know I sure didn't, and when I
looked at how well they seem to hold their value, and their nearly
linear depreciation (as opposed to some cars whose values fall off a
steep cliff when you drive em off the lot), you may find that it's
worth it to buy new and take advantage of some incentive financing,
and the ability to get what you want rather than picking from the 1 or
2 used 2003 Outbacks in your area. Say you keep a car 6 years,
assuming depreciation is linear no matter if you buy it new, or buy it
1 year old, your cost of ownership is the same over that same period,
and you get all the fun and choice of being able to buy new and get
perfect info on what the seller paid for the vehicle (edmunds.com,
consumerreports.com). The same can't be said for the used market.

Anyhoo, have fun and do get to a new lot to test drive both models
news since the 04's are little different than the 03's.

Best Regards,

 

[MDCORE]

The downsides to the H6 appear to be a bit of an issue with

reliability apparently--someone mentioned it's actually on a list of
cars to avoid list somewhere.

That person was a troll- it is not on CR's list of cars toa void.

And also, the cost since the H6 is
only available in the tpo of the line models (LL Bean and the VDC I
think).

I believe the 6 cyl is now an option without the added LL Bean trappings, or
the VDC.

Dukephoto
'01 VDC- 80,000+ miles

 

[Todd H.]

That person was a troll- it is not on CR's list of cars toa void.

Cool. Duly noted.

I believe the 6 cyl is now an option without the added LL Bean trappings, or
the VDC.

Oh yer right--I was in the dealer last week and I think the 2004
models have that as an option, but it's kinda steep--$3k-$4k adder if
I remember?

Best Regards,

 

[MH]

That person was a troll- it is not on CR's list of cars toa void.


I believe the 6 cyl is now an option without the added LL Bean trappings, or
the VDC.

Dukephoto
'01 VDC- 80,000+ miles

Look at the CR 2004 Annual Car report issue, then "used cars to avoid." You
will find the 2003 Subaru H6 there, as well as the Baja.

 

[Griffith Jones]

I can attest to the accuracy of this posting, being a CR subscriber. 2003
Baja and 2003 Legacy Outback 6 cylinder are deemed "Used cars to avoid" in
the Aptil 2004 issue. It's on page 81 ...
GJJ

 

[Florian Feuser /FFF/]

I can attest to the accuracy of this posting, being a CR subscriber. 2003
Baja and 2003 Legacy Outback 6 cylinder are deemed "Used cars to avoid" in
the Aptil 2004 issue. It's on page 81 ...

I am avoiding it alright since I can't afford one.
What exactly is the recommendation by CR based on?

Florian

 

[Griffith Jones]

CR evaluations are based on sruveys sent out to its subscribers -- I
received and submitted one myself. You are prompted for the year of your
vehicle, and asked to check off any sub-system that needed repairing that
year.

CR does not give much detail on the poor showing for the 2003 Suburu Baja
and Outback H6, except to say that first year reliability has been
"disappointing" for the Baja. For all cars it reviews, CR breaks down
troublespots by subsystem, and gives history for 8 years. The 2003 Baja is
rated average for "body integrity", with the other categories are described
as having fewer problems than average. I think "average" can be considered
sub-par for a major Japanese brand. CR tends to give Honda and Toyota
reliability ratings of "better" or "much better than average" across the
board.

The 2003 Legacy Outback 4 cylinder is recomended, it is only the 6 cylinder
edition that should be avoided, according to CR.
The reliability stats for Legacy Outback 6 cylinder are not given. The 4
cylinder version is described as having "average" reliability, as is the
Impreza. I'm not sure if this means that the 6 cylinder engine is the
guilty party here, in terms of the bad rating.

GJJ