Extending headlight life

[Dr. Rastis Fafoofnik]

If you don't believe me, read all about it from YOUR choice of Halogen Lamp
manufactures.
It's a fact...low operating temp (low voltage) dramatically shortens the
lamp's life.

Apparently he really is that stupid. Your point JD about every manufacturer, including Ford, using the same reduced power DRL's went right over his pointy little head.

Here is the halogen info from that ceiling fan site <rolls eyes> that you provided:
Dimming Halogen Lamps:
Line voltage (120V) halogen bulbs can be dimmed by regular incandescent dimmers. Using a dimmer with halogen bulbs actually has negative effects. When dimmed, the halogen filaments do not reach the 250 C needed for the halogen cycle to take place. This could cause the inside wall of the bulb to blacken reducing light quantity and life. Running the lamp at full brightness will help restore and clean the bulb.

Then you go on to say...

In studies, the "Norn" has been that once the tungsten deposits itself on
the glass it DOES NOT clean up and the lamp
is on its way out.

Funny, that's not what I read above. Bulb deposits will return to the halogen cycle once proper operating temperature is reached.

But this whole point is not applicable anyway. It's the people who run their ceiling fan lamps down to 30 - 40% output over a long time that will experience blackening in halogen bulbs. DRLs in Subaru vehicles operate at approx. 80% output which maintains the heat necessary for the halogen cycle to work. What evidence do you have to the contrary?

I'm sick and tired of you spewing crap on this NG. Go away and find something constructive to do with your life. Maybe you will even find the time to defend yourself against the Prodigy investigators who are now alerted to your constant abuse of this newsgroup.

YOUR "Sick and Tired" thats a laugh, It has everything to do with your lights...120 volts or 12 volts...ceiling fan or vehicle..they both vibrate.

Your quote of 80% is 20% below the rated operating voltage. It's in a lot of tech journals, read it again..and we have found in general they DO NOT clean up after a while.

In theory yes..in real life NO, they fail early. If you were so god damn smart you would install a lower wattage DRL that operates at the proper temp, but your bucket of shit cars have a LOT more problems then lights that fail early (like transmissions,engines and a lot of other cheap crap)

Will be a sad day when a puke in his Subaru can tell me he has more engineering skills than I have learned in my lifetime doing this kind of engineering work.

 

[Mickey]

"Spudster" <(e-mail address removed)
"Dr. Rastis Fafoofnik" < (e-mail address removed)

Apparently he really is that stupid. Your point JD about every
manufacturer, including Ford, using the same reduced power DRL's
went right over his pointy little head.

Here is the halogen info from that ceiling fan site <rolls eyes>
that you provided:


/Dimming Halogen Lamps:/

/Line voltage (120V) halogen bulbs can be dimmed by regular
incandescent dimmers. Using a dimmer with halogen bulbs actually has
negative effects. When dimmed, the halogen filaments do not reach
the 250 C needed for the halogen cycle to take place. This could
cause the inside wall of the bulb to blacken reducing light quantity
and life. Running the lamp at full brightness will help restore and
clean the bulb./

Then you go on to say...


Funny, that's not what I read above. Bulb deposits will return to
the halogen cycle once proper operating temperature is reached.

But this whole point is not applicable anyway. It's the people who
run their ceiling fan lamps down to 30 - 40% output over a long time
that will experience blackening in halogen bulbs. DRLs in Subaru
vehicles operate at approx. 80% output which maintains the heat
necessary for the halogen cycle to work. What evidence do you have
to the contrary?

I'm sick and tired of you spewing crap on this NG. Go away and find
something constructive to do with your life. Maybe you will even
find the time to defend yourself against the Prodigy investigators
who are now alerted to your constant abuse of this newsgroup.

YOUR "Sick and Tired" thats a laugh, It has everything to do with
your lights...120 volts or 12 volts...ceiling fan or vehicle..they
both vibrate.

Your quote of 80% is 20% below the rated operating voltage. It's in
a lot of tech journals, read it again..and we have found in general
they DO NOT clean up after a while.

In theory yes..in real life NO, they fail early. If you were so god
damn smart you would install a lower wattage DRL that operates at
the proper temp, but your bucket of shit cars have a LOT more
problems then lights that fail early (like transmissions,engines and
a lot of other cheap crap)

Will be a sad day when a puke in his Subaru can tell me he has more
engineering skills than I have learned in my lifetime doing this
kind of engineering work.

Tell us Dr. What is the relationship between voltage and brightness
for incandescent lights? Is the 80% figure mentioned, voltage or
brightness? Here's a clue, it isn't a linear function.

 

[Matt B]

I believe Subaru expects me to drive at night in #3, but I usually use
#2. For my 99% urban driving, I don't need that much illumination, and I
bet it prolongs headlamp life and I love to save :-D

Disable your Daytime Running Lights. They have been
proven to be a non-safety factor rated option which does
not reduce your chance of an accident - period.

DRL's are NECESSARY for low profile motor-powered
items like *motorcycles* (I never ride my HD without the
headlight off) but using DRL's on cars and trucks makes
as much sense as using a flashlight to find your way in
broad daylight on a 95° July afternoon in Texas.

Disable the DRL's in a Subaru is rather easy.
For most you want to unplug the large silver-colored resistor
located on the passenger's side wheel strut tower
and then place a small ziplock baggie over the
wire connector you just unplugged. This is a 2-wire
connector. Your headlights will then act like a
NORMAL car, meaning they will be off when the
switch is off.

Go the the URL below and select
the "Disable DRL's" button and look
up the Subaru section.

http://www.lightsout.org/about.html

 

[Remco]

Who called a doctor? Is somebody sick?

Why are you bothering with us lowly Subaru driving laymen and troll
some other group?
We're clearly not worthy of your presence..

 

[WisedUp]

Headlight bulbs are not expensive. Do the rest of your town a favor and
just leave the lights on.

I agree that headlight bulbs are not in themselves expensive.

But my 2005 Forester requires some semi-major disassembly to get at the bulbs
and replace them. I do not feel qualified to do this myself and having the
dealer do it certainly jacks up the replacement cost.

Another triumph of form over function . . .

 

[Dr. Rastis Fafoofnik]

Tell us Dr. What is the relationship between voltage and brightness
for incandescent lights? Is the 80% figure mentioned, voltage or
brightness? Here's a clue, it isn't a linear function.

You are correct Mickey, it's NOT linear(it's LOG). And filament temp is
critical in Halogen recycle lamps.The article calls out the proper temp and
how
the "Recycle" works.
The 80% figure was for VOLTAGE.

 

[JD]

It's impossible to drive with both the DRLs and parking lights on, since
as soon as you turn the parking lights on the DRLs will go off.
The problem with driving with DRLs only is that aside from the reduced
intensity only the headlights are on, the parking lights are off so you
have no markers or taillights. From the rear the car will be completely
dark.

Not true. The DRLs stay on whether the park lights are on or not.

 

[JD]

Disable your Daytime Running Lights. They have been
proven to be a non-safety factor rated option which does
not reduce your chance of an accident - period.

I would love to see your 'proof'. DRLs reduce the chances of head-on
collisions on two-lane and non-divided highways. Ample studies were done by
the insurance industry which is why they reduce the rates for functioning
DRLs

DRL's are NECESSARY for low profile motor-powered
items like *motorcycles* (I never ride my HD without the
headlight off) but using DRL's on cars and trucks makes
as much sense as using a flashlight to find your way in
broad daylight on a 95° July afternoon in Texas.

They are not to help you find your way, they are so other people can see you
and judge your distance.

 

[JD]

If you don't believe me, read all about it from YOUR choice of Halogen Lamp
manufactures.
It's a fact...low operating temp (low voltage) dramatically shortens the
lamp's life.

Apparently he really is that stupid. Your point JD about every manufacturer, including Ford, using the same reduced power DRL's went right over his pointy little head.

Here is the halogen info from that ceiling fan site <rolls eyes> that you provided:
Dimming Halogen Lamps:
Line voltage (120V) halogen bulbs can be dimmed by regular incandescent dimmers. Using a dimmer with halogen bulbs actually has negative effects. When dimmed, the halogen filaments do not reach the 250 C needed for the halogen cycle to take place. This could cause the inside wall of the bulb to blacken reducing light quantity and life. Running the lamp at full brightness will help restore and clean the bulb.

Then you go on to say...

In studies, the "Norn" has been that once the tungsten deposits itself on
the glass it DOES NOT clean up and the lamp
is on its way out.

Funny, that's not what I read above. Bulb deposits will return to the halogen cycle once proper operating temperature is reached.

But this whole point is not applicable anyway. It's the people who run their ceiling fan lamps down to 30 - 40% output over a long time that will experience blackening in halogen bulbs. DRLs in Subaru vehicles operate at approx. 80% output which maintains the heat necessary for the halogen cycle to work. What evidence do you have to the contrary?

I'm sick and tired of you spewing crap on this NG. Go away and find something constructive to do with your life. Maybe you will even find the time to defend yourself against the Prodigy investigators who are now alerted to your constant abuse of this newsgroup.

YOUR "Sick and Tired" thats a laugh, It has everything to do with your lights...120 volts or 12 volts...ceiling fan or vehicle..they both vibrate.

Your quote of 80% is 20% below the rated operating voltage. It's in a lot of tech journals, read it again..and we have found in general they DO NOT clean up after a while.

In theory yes..in real life NO, they fail early. If you were so god damn smart you would install a lower wattage DRL that operates at the proper temp, but your bucket of shit cars have a LOT more problems then lights that fail early (like transmissions,engines and a lot of other cheap crap)

Will be a sad day when a puke in his Subaru can tell me he has more engineering skills than I have learned in my lifetime doing this kind of engineering work.

I would guess by the garbage you try to convince of of, you would have difficulty spelling engineering much less practicing it. As I said, virtually every manufacturer that sells a car in Canada installs DRLs in the same way. I have had three DRL-fitted cars with halogen bulbs (all different manufacturers), and none of them had the bulbs blacken, fail prematurely, are behave in any manner other than expected.

 

[JD]

You are correct Mickey, it's NOT linear(it's LOG). And filament temp is
critical in Halogen recycle lamps.The article calls out the proper temp and
how
the "Recycle" works.
The 80% figure was for VOLTAGE.

The 80% figure used for DRLs is brilliance, not voltage.

 

[Adam Helberg]

A long time ago, decades perhaps, I heard something about people in
South America, or somewhere having a lot of accidents at night, because
they often drove without their headlights. They did this because they
wanted to prolong headlight life. Pretty screwy, huh?
Fast forward decades . . .
--- --- --- --- --- --- ---
Five months ago I got my Forester. I finally have figured out how to
work the headlights. Although there are other possibilities, I have
learned the following
hierarchy of control:

1 Daytime lights on at all times
2 #1 plus tail lights and dash lights
3 #2 plus headlights brighter
4 #3 plus headlights high beam.

I believe Subaru expects me to drive at night in #3, but I usually use
#2. For my 99% urban driving, I don't need that much illumination, and I
bet it prolongs headlamp life and I love to save :-D

Does everyone do this, or should I move to South America, or am I, once
again, a genius ahead of my time?

Pete

This makes no sense. A new low-beam bulb costs $9, so what are you saving. With less
light the distance you can see at night is shorter providing less time for you react
to road hazards or people. One accident can cause injury and thousands of dollars.
Your thinking makes no sense.

Adam

Adam

 

[Adam Helberg]

I would love to see your 'proof'. DRLs reduce the chances of head-on
collisions on two-lane and non-divided highways. Ample studies were done by
the insurance industry which is why they reduce the rates for functioning
DRLs

I agree. DRL improve your chances of being seen and of being correctly identified as
moving towards the observer. On the other hand there is no valid reason for disabling
the DRLs. The cost of a light bulb is neglible and the extra amount of power is
negligible as well.

Adam

 

[georgew]

I would love to see your 'proof'. DRLs reduce the chances of head-on
collisions on two-lane and non-divided highways. Ample studies were done by
the insurance industry which is why they reduce the rates for functioning
DRLs

[...]

Surprising as it might seem, there is plenty of evidence to show that
running headlights during the day on motorcycles is ineffective as an
anti-collision measure. If a car driver is not going to see a
motorcycle, he/she won't see it whether or not the headlights are on.
Having said that, I like the feeling I get when I run my bike with
them on. Same applies with my British racing green jeep. It can't hurt
to be more visible, I always say.

GW

 

[JazzMan]

I would love to see your 'proof'. DRLs reduce the chances of head-on
collisions on two-lane and non-divided highways. Ample studies were done by
the insurance industry which is why they reduce the rates for functioning
DRLs

[...]

Surprising as it might seem, there is plenty of evidence to show that
running headlights during the day on motorcycles is ineffective as an
anti-collision measure. If a car driver is not going to see a
motorcycle, he/she won't see it whether or not the headlights are on.
Having said that, I like the feeling I get when I run my bike with
them on. Same applies with my British racing green jeep. It can't hurt
to be more visible, I always say.

GW

The reason DRLs, and third brake lights, and all the other
gimmicks that get tried over the years seem to work well is
because when they're tested and introduced they are the
exception. Before DRLs came out if you saw a car with lights
on during the day it really stood out and grabbed your
attention. The same with motorcycle headlights, and mostly
the same with 3rd brake lights. Now that everyone has them
they no longer stand out, nobody really notices. In fact,
I'm more inclined to notice a motorcycle that doesn't have
its lights on, the same as a car without DRLs.

JazzMan
--
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**********************************************************

 

[JD]

I believe Subaru expects me to drive at night in #3, but I usually use
#2. For my 99% urban driving, I don't need that much illumination, and I
bet it prolongs headlamp life and I love to save :-D

Disable your Daytime Running Lights. They have been
proven to be a non-safety factor rated option which does
not reduce your chance of an accident - period.

I would love to see your 'proof'. DRLs reduce the chances of head-on
collisions on two-lane and non-divided highways. Ample studies were done by
the insurance industry which is why they reduce the rates for functioning
DRLs

DRL's are NECESSARY for low profile motor-powered
items like *motorcycles* (I never ride my HD without the
headlight off) but using DRL's on cars and trucks makes
as much sense as using a flashlight to find your way in
broad daylight on a 95° July afternoon in Texas.

[...]

Surprising as it might seem, there is plenty of evidence to show that
running headlights during the day on motorcycles is ineffective as an
anti-collision measure. If a car driver is not going to see a
motorcycle, he/she won't see it whether or not the headlights are on.
Having said that, I like the feeling I get when I run my bike with
them on. Same applies with my British racing green jeep. It can't hurt
to be more visible, I always say.

GW

The reason DRLs, and third brake lights, and all the other
gimmicks that get tried over the years seem to work well is
because when they're tested and introduced they are the
exception. Before DRLs came out if you saw a car with lights
on during the day it really stood out and grabbed your
attention. The same with motorcycle headlights, and mostly
the same with 3rd brake lights. Now that everyone has them
they no longer stand out, nobody really notices. In fact,
I'm more inclined to notice a motorcycle that doesn't have
its lights on, the same as a car without DRLs.

I am the opposite. I find it much easier to judge the distance of a car
with DRLs on. And, whether one has annecdotal eveidence to the contrary or
not, the insurance industry has done several studies that show they are
safer. Its the reason that they reduce rates for functioning DRLs (or more
correctly, increase the rates for cars not fitted with them). They tend not
to do that without substantial research into risk factors.

At any rate, again, I would love to see this 'proof' or 'evidence' that they
don't help. I have seen plenty that shows that they do.

 

[georgew]

At any rate, again, I would love to see this 'proof' or 'evidence' that they
don't help. I have seen plenty that shows that they do.

As I said , I like to run my lights in times of low visibility during
the day or night.

A number analyses in Australia have shown that DRL's may be marginally
effective at reducing accidents but the margins are fuzzy. In recent
years there has been increasing interest in dedicated DRL's that are
cheaper and more effective than headlights. At present, in Australia
at least, the jury is out and there is no legal requirement for DRL's.
This was not always the case for motorcycles and there are plenty of
pre - '98 vintage MC's running around with worn out hard - wired
headlights shining dimly during the day.

A couple of interesting studies, and there are plenty more if you want
to google for yourself:

http://members.optusnet.com.au/carsafety/paine_drl_nrma_racv.pdf

http://www.atsb.gov.au/road/res-exec/cr218ex.cfm

 

[JD]

As I said , I like to run my lights in times of low visibility during
the day or night.

A number analyses in Australia have shown that DRL's may be marginally
effective at reducing accidents but the margins are fuzzy. In recent
years there has been increasing interest in dedicated DRL's that are
cheaper and more effective than headlights. At present, in Australia
at least, the jury is out and there is no legal requirement for DRL's.
This was not always the case for motorcycles and there are plenty of
pre - '98 vintage MC's running around with worn out hard - wired
headlights shining dimly during the day.

A couple of interesting studies, and there are plenty more if you want
to google for yourself:

http://members.optusnet.com.au/carsafety/paine_drl_nrma_racv.pdf

http://www.atsb.gov.au/road/res-exec/cr218ex.cfm

I just read those articles. The conclusions don't look marginal at all; 20%
reduction in daytime head-on accidents. In addition, the study also
recommends DRLs become mandatory in Australia.

 

[georgew]

I just read those articles. The conclusions don't look marginal at all; 20%
reduction in daytime head-on accidents. In addition, the study also
recommends DRLs become mandatory in Australia.

Yes, and it seems my earlier comments were a bit out of date. However
some State and Federal laws were in place a few years ago that
mandated hard-wired headlights in motorcycles, and these have been
withdrawn. The studies in the links do not necessarily recommend hard
wired headlights, they tend more toward purpose-built daylight warning
lights, and I guess that was more to the point in this thread.
The whole thing is still not clear to the experts, let alone to
klutzes like me. Margins are fuzzy as I said. Cost-benefit margins are
even less clear, and that's what those links were about.
I repeat that I use my own headlights in daylight when I'm in doubt
about the visibility of my vehicle, because common sense dictates that
I'm more visible with them on.

 

[tom]

long BEFORE daytime running lights were mandatory, i started driving
with my lights on. even though my car is equipped with daytime running
lights, i automatically flip on the headlights before putting the car
in gear. and i sometimes even use high-beams during daylight when i
want extra visibility, such as passing a line of stopped cars.

visibility is useful, and *sometimes* helps other drivers' judgment,
by making them think i am closer or moving faster than i actually am.
it isn't guaranteed, and it doesn't do much for the braindead or the
cellphone-challenged, but every little bit helps.

whether or not headlights during daytime can be proven to be safer,
it's not hard to understand why having *less* lights than other cars is
more dangerous - most people have seen cars without lights (or with
burnt out headlights) at night. the "stealth approach" throws off our
judgment of both speed and distance.

i don't think i replace my headlights more than the average (about
every 3 years), so i wouldn't worry too much about that. and if it's
really a pain to replace them, i'll just pay a little extra for
longer-life bulbs.

but i was astonished to find a lobby group online who adamantly opposes
daytime running lights, for all kinds of really silly reasons,
including a driver's "right" to turn off their lights! just like the
"right" to crash a motorcycle without a helmet. now i can add
"extended bulb life" to that list...