Synthetic oil

[Peter]

Good day all. Perhaps this question has been asked before but here
goes: my car has roughly 261000 kms on it. I am thinking of changing
oil to synthetic oil. Is this a good idea?

Pete

 

[Hal Whelply]

Let's see, 261,000 km translates to approximately 175,000 miles. I'd say, if
you're doing that well on dino oil, why switch?!

 

[Chris Phillipo]

Let's see, 261,000 km translates to approximately 175,000 miles. I'd say, if
you're doing that well on dino oil, why switch?!

I think he's being lured by claims of better mileage and more power but
these are bearly perceptible in real life except for the every present
"placebo" effect

 

[Rick Courtright]

goes: my car has roughly 261000 kms on it. I am thinking of changing

Hi,

You realize you're about to unleash the synthetic vs dino oil monster
yet again? But before you do, I'd suggest you stick with dino oil at
this late date. You MAY find your engine leaking more than before (no,
syn oil doesn't cause leaks per se, but if you've got some that are just
being prevented by sludge or goo, it often tends to clean better than
dino oil.) And as another poster put it, you'll probably be hard pressed
to see enough difference in anything to justify the cost. (I've been
that route, kept good records, saw no improvement that wasn't with
statistical probability with any oil.)

It's up to you--my opinion is wait until you've got a new motor to go
the syn-oil route.

Rick

 

[Guest]

Good day all. Perhaps this question has been asked before but here
goes: my car has roughly 261000 kms on it. I am thinking of changing
oil to synthetic oil. Is this a good idea?

Pete

My advice - switch. I have Outback '97 with 120kMiles. After I switched to
full synthetic oil (through 2 semi-synth oil change), knocking sound with
cold engine is gone. Can't say about mileage or power, since I changed
oxygen sensors recently, but I really like how engine works now. Plus,
before I always added oil between changes. Not much, may be 1/3 - 1/2 quart
on 3000-4000 miles. Now I change oil every 6000 miles and I don't add
anything between.

 

[JaySee]

I think he's being lured by claims of better mileage and more power but
these are bearly perceptible in real life except for the every present
"placebo" effect

I get much better mileage after switching to Mobil-1 Synthetic over
the OEM Valvoline Dino Oil. Usually 5 more miles a gallon.

 

[Edward Hayes]

After switching to Mobil 1 engine oil and both differentials to Mobil1 gear
oil I realized about 0.5 mpg improvement. This improvement will never cover
the increased cost of Synthetic oil if I drive a million miles.

 

[Peter]

Thanks for the inputs guys.

Pete

After switching to Mobil 1 engine oil and both differentials to Mobil1 gear
oil I realized about 0.5 mpg improvement. This improvement will never cover
the increased cost of Synthetic oil if I drive a million miles.


say, if

 

[y_p_w]

Peter wrote:




Hi,

You realize you're about to unleash the synthetic vs dino oil monster
yet again? But before you do, I'd suggest you stick with dino oil at
this late date. You MAY find your engine leaking more than before (no,
syn oil doesn't cause leaks per se, but if you've got some that are just
being prevented by sludge or goo, it often tends to clean better than
dino oil.) And as another poster put it, you'll probably be hard pressed
to see enough difference in anything to justify the cost. (I've been
that route, kept good records, saw no improvement that wasn't with
statistical probability with any oil.)

This is the excuse often cited by Amsoil sales droids (i.e. the
"cleaning out stuff"), which apparently is a myth.

The biggest problem with leaking comes from the tendency of (synthetic)
polyalphaolefin base oils to leach out plasticizers from the seals.
The seals become hard and shrink. There was a real bad problem when
Mobil 1 first became available in the early 80's. They've learned, and
increased the seal-swell additives to compensate, as well as added an
ester base which also helps. In addition, seal materials have been
engineered with synthetic oil compatibility in mind.

I've heard reports of initial leaks with PAO synthetic, which stopped
after some time. The seal compatibility ingredients might not be
enough initially in an older car whose seals are borderline ready to
leak, but eventually "catch up" and restore the seals.

 

[Don]

This is the excuse often cited by Amsoil sales droids (i.e. the
"cleaning out stuff"), which apparently is a myth.

The biggest problem with leaking comes from the tendency of (synthetic)
polyalphaolefin base oils to leach out plasticizers from the seals.
The seals become hard and shrink. There was a real bad problem when
Mobil 1 first became available in the early 80's. They've learned, and
increased the seal-swell additives to compensate, as well as added an
ester base which also helps. In addition, seal materials have been
engineered with synthetic oil compatibility in mind.

I've heard reports of initial leaks with PAO synthetic, which stopped
after some time. The seal compatibility ingredients might not be
enough initially in an older car whose seals are borderline ready to
leak, but eventually "catch up" and restore the seals.

In 1998 I bought an '88 Porsche Carrera with 50K miles on it.
I switched to Amsoil in the transaxle as soon as I got the car because
of a hesitation in shifting from low to 2nd. Didn't do any good, later
found out why, and 6 months later it started leaking through the shifter
shaft input. That's when I heard about the tendancy of synthetics to cause
leaks in "older vehicles". Don't know that I "proved" it, but certainly
"experienced" it, and it was costly.
Username munged by FixNews

 

[Rick Courtright]

shaft input. That's when I heard about the tendancy of synthetics to cause
leaks in "older vehicles". Don't know that I "proved" it, but certainly
"experienced" it, and it was costly.

Hi,

Considering the age of the vehicle, and my experience regarding the
overall quality of German seals (sorry to offend anyone, but I gave up
on the Fatherland's ability to produce an oil tight mechanism years ago!
Kitty litter on a drip pan under my several VWs and one Porsche proved
much cheaper than constantly replacing seals! Friends tell me their M-Bs
and BMWs share the problem), it's hard to assign blame. As y_p_w
mentioned, there have been a variety of changes in both the oil and
seals over the years. My guess is your experience (shared by many of us)
results from a combination of causes. And, yes, it does prove costly!
One reason I don't suggest a switch on a hi-mileage engine. (Or
gearbox/transaxle/diff?) Naturally, this is a YMMV item!

Rick

 

[Pete D]

Actually the guides that the oil companies put out are a pretty good guide.
They don't recomend full synthetic, at least the ones I have read, a semi
will do better.

: Thanks for the inputs guys.
:
: Pete
:
: Edward Hayes wrote:
: > After switching to Mobil 1 engine oil and both differentials to Mobil1
gear
: > oil I realized about 0.5 mpg improvement. This improvement will never
cover
: > the increased cost of Synthetic oil if I drive a million miles.
: > : >
: >>On Mon, 17 May 2004 00:54:52 -0300, Chris Phillipo
: >>
: >>
: >>>In article <vAWpc.52877$Z%5.1441@okepread01>, (e-mail address removed) says...
: >>>
: >>>>Let's see, 261,000 km translates to approximately 175,000 miles. I'd
: >
: > say, if
: >
: >>>>you're doing that well on dino oil, why switch?!
: >>>>
: >>>
: >>>I think he's being lured by claims of better mileage and more power but
: >>>these are bearly perceptible in real life except for the every present
: >>>"placebo" effect
: >>
: >>I get much better mileage after switching to Mobil-1 Synthetic over
: >>the OEM Valvoline Dino Oil. Usually 5 more miles a gallon.
: >
: >
: >
:

 

[Hal Whelply]

Pete,

"...[A] semi [synthetic] will do better [than a full synthetic]??

How so? Why, exactly? Where can I read more on this?

Thanks.

HW

 

[Edward Hayes]

I don't believe it. Identify your source for that information. Ed

Pete,

"...[A] semi [synthetic] will do better [than a full synthetic]??

How so? Why, exactly? Where can I read more on this?

Thanks.

HW

Actually the guides that the oil companies put out are a pretty good guide.
They don't recomend full synthetic, at least the ones I have read, a semi
will do better.

 

[TG]

Better on your wallet!

Pete,

"...[A] semi [synthetic] will do better [than a full synthetic]??

How so? Why, exactly? Where can I read more on this?

Thanks.

HW

Actually the guides that the oil companies put out are a pretty good guide.
They don't recomend full synthetic, at least the ones I have read, a semi
will do better.

 

[Guest]

Better on your wallet!

C'mon... $7-8 for 5qt for regular oil and $17-20 for full synth is not so
big expence (I even don't consider 50c "second hand oil"). Especially
considering the fact that you may change oil not at 3500 miles, but at 7000.
Plus, you have a slight savings on MPG (I do). Plus, I don't add oil between
changes as with regular oil (I did before). And finaly, my pistons stop
knocking since I started using full synth. I'm happy with synthetic...

 

[TG]

The full synthetic was running me $41.75 for 5 quarts...what do you run? TG

 

[y_p_w]

The full synthetic was running me $41.75 for 5 quarts...what do you run? TG

I plan on using Mobil 1 5W-30 at regular change intervals. It costs me
at most $20 for a 5 qt jug at Wal-Mart, or $3.39/qt at local Target
Store (only one location has this price though).

 

[Jim Stewart]

I plan on using Mobil 1 5W-30 at regular change intervals. It costs me
at most $20 for a 5 qt jug at Wal-Mart, or $3.39/qt at local Target
Store (only one location has this price though).

If your valves clatter too much when cold, try
Mobil 1 10W-30. It was much better than 5W-30
in my 2.5l DOHC.

 

[Guest]

The full synthetic was running me $41.75 for 5 quarts...what do you run? TG

Where and when you had these prices? You were ripped off. WallMart sells 5qt
canister for $18-22. I'm purchasing NAPA Full Synth (actually it's Valvoline
oil) for 3.45-3.50 because I need 4qt per change, so, it costs me $14 per
change. I use 5w30 and my valves are quite like new