Oil Changes; Synthetic oils

[Gunny]

We bought a new OBW last year, the L.L.Bean edition. It's my first new
car in...wait for it...37 years! Everything in between has been
purchased used (don't you just detest "pre-owned"?).

I know that oils have improved greatly and engines have changed a lot
over the years, so thought I'd ask about oil-change intervals for this
vehicle.

We rarely find ourselves in stop and go traffic; we are usually moving
along at 30 to 70 mph with the stop for the occasional stop light/sign.
With that sort of driving, I felt that an oil/filter change every
4,000 miles would be more than adequate. Do list readers agree or
disagree???

Eventually, we will change to sythetic oil and that leads to me second
two questions:

What's the optimal mileage for the switchover. Wait until 10k, 20k,
longer?

And is pure synthetic best or is the petroleum/synthetic mix better. I
have heard a very persuasive argument made for the mix because it
absolutely will not foam whereas the pure synthetic can indeed foam.
And, of course, foam indicates the presence of air and where there is
air, there is no oil and no lubrication.

Thanks,
Gunny

 

[Rick Courtright]

Hi, Gunny

Well, I've only seen one way to stir things up faster than ask "what
kind of oil and how often to change it?" in an automotive forum, and
that was when I was kid in San Diego and watched a coupla drunken
sailors stumble into a bar full of Marines and holler out, "You guyshhh
are all a bunch of wimpshhhhh!" It got exciting FAST! And that's about
what you'll see in your answers here (or other auto forums!)

We all have our opinions, but that's all they are. I've challenged
people over the years to "show me your numbers" about why this or that
is better, and nobody can...

So I'll give you MY opinion, based on the last million miles I've
driven: pick your favorite brand of dino oil in the right weight and
service grade (API, ILSAC), change it and your filter every 3000 miles
(or use your book's recommendation for "severe" service), and report
back in a quarter of a million miles if there's any oil-related problem!

People are going to tell you that's a waste of money. They're going to
tell you this filter is better and that one's garbage, they're going to
make it seem like your engine will probably just fall off its mounts if
you don't use their brand of oil. It's almost all bunk! Clean oil's
about the cheapest insurance you can buy for your car, and as long as
your choice meets the mfrs recommendation, you're good!

Synthetics? Yeah, they seem to be "better" than dino oils. But how much
better and at what cost? I've tried several of them, and I keep pretty
detailed records of such stuff. Never have they proven to be cost
effective for me. I live near Palm Springs, CA, and it's just a bit warm
this time of year (111 deg F yesterday, should finish warmer today.) I'm
currently running a "test" w/ Super-Tech synthetic (from Wally
World--the cheapest one on the market. In the past I've "tested" Amsoil
before there were really any others on the open market, Mobil 1, and
Castrol Syntec) in two vehicles to see if anything's changed as far as
cost effectiveness. So far, no joy. Where synthetics shine in my book is
their ability to clean, and keep things clean, particularly if there's
much varnish in an engine. Your "new" LLBean shouldn't have that
problem!

"True" synthetics vs "that's not a true" synthetic? Synthetic blends?
You pays your money and you makes your choices. There's plenty of
argument about what IS or IS NOT synthetic. Ever get in those Ford vs
Chevy arguments at lunch in high school? Same concept. All the big oil
companies have been butting heads, mostly in court, about the definition
of "synthetic" and basically, for US purposes, it's marketing that wins
out. You REALLY don't know any more about what you're getting than what
it says on the jug.

When to do the switchover to a synthetic? Whenever you feel like it.
Several cars today come from the factory w/ Mobil 1 from the get go.
Mobil says the "run it x number of miles to break in" is an urban myth.
Others swear you should put 3-6k miles on dino oil first. You should
have that kind of mileage already? If so, the question's moot.

The only "bad" thing about a switchover is if you have a hi-mileage car
that's not leaking cuz the seals are being "helped" by a build up of goo
over the years: it's likely a synthetic will clean things out well
enough a "hidden" leak may surface. But today's synthetics by and of
themselves don't CAUSE leaks.

Extended drain intervals w/ synthetics? You'll see all kinds of claims.
If your car's under warranty, they're all bunk, cuz you've gotta follow
the warranty instructions or void it. I'm sure it's quite likely you CAN
run fairly long OCIs (oil change intervals) w/ the kind of driving
you've proposed, but it's usually suggested you do oil analysis to know
for sure. So you can change your oil at 3000 miles w/ dino oil for $20,
and know for the next 3000 you're good. Or you can spend $20-$30 at 3000
for an oil analysis on your far more expensive synthetic oil that might
say "change right this minute" or "come back in 3000 miles and we'll do
this again." See any economy in that? You're not saving any money, just
making different choices on how to spend about the same amount!

So, those are MY opinions, and we'll see if I've done my part to get
things flying... but in the long run, do what makes YOU comfortable at
the spending level you find acceptable, and you should be just fine
REGARDLESS of what you choose!

Rick

 

[Tcassette]

I have changed the oil and filter every 5000 miles on several different cars
over the past 30 years, including my current 96 Outback. Using Castrol GTX
and decent filters, I have never had a problem related to the oil itself.
That said, I have experienced leaking seals on the Outback, but I attribute
that to seal quality and age; I could have changed the oil every 100 miles
and still have the leaks.

 

[Bob H]

We bought a new OBW last year, the L.L.Bean edition. It's my first new
car in...wait for it...37 years! Everything in between has been
purchased used (don't you just detest "pre-owned"?).

//////snipped

If you use dino juice you can easily change at 5.000 mile intervals. Subies
are notoriously easy on oil. Use a decent brand with a good additive
package.

If you want to switch to synth, do it after 1,000 miles. It comes as
factory fill on some cars now, so don't worry about racking up the miles.
For example, Mobil1 states their products can be used from the get-go.

If you change your own oil, use whatever is decent and on sale.

5.000 miles is not a long stretch for today's oils, but I wouldn't push it
much further on dino. Synth is a different story, however.

If you really want the scoop, check out www.bobistheoilguy.com .

 

[IndianaAdam]

I've had my 95 Legacy for a few years now, and have combined personal
experience with suggestions from a mechanic.

Frequency-- I eyeball it. Synth seems to generally last a little
longer, but once they honey color is going, I change my oil Seems to be
around 5000 miles or so. 3000 went out the window some time ago. The
Cartalk guys follow this line of thinking as well.

Type- A mechanic once told me that Subarus that run with synthetic have
far fewer problems with seals than those that run with regular dino
oil, primarily because the dino oil, if not changed regularly , can
actually damage the seals. I don't know if it's true or not. My last
oil changed found me using Quaker State with slick 50. It felt like my
car ran a lot smoother immediately.

Now to find the brake thread.. since I have to change mine out..

 

[M.J.]

We bought a new OBW last year, the L.L.Bean edition. It's my first new
car in...wait for it...37 years! Everything in between has been
purchased used (don't you just detest "pre-owned"?).

I know that oils have improved greatly and engines have changed a lot
over the years, so thought I'd ask about oil-change intervals for this
vehicle.

We rarely find ourselves in stop and go traffic; we are usually moving
along at 30 to 70 mph with the stop for the occasional stop light/sign.
With that sort of driving, I felt that an oil/filter change every
4,000 miles would be more than adequate. Do list readers agree or
disagree???

Eventually, we will change to sythetic oil and that leads to me second
two questions:

What's the optimal mileage for the switchover. Wait until 10k, 20k,
longer?

And is pure synthetic best or is the petroleum/synthetic mix better. I
have heard a very persuasive argument made for the mix because it
absolutely will not foam whereas the pure synthetic can indeed foam.
And, of course, foam indicates the presence of air and where there is
air, there is no oil and no lubrication.

Thanks,
Gunny

Generally speaking, and somewhat from a European perspective,
any car with a small displacement (high rpm) engine for best protection
should be given synthetic oils. By small displacement, loosely speaking,
I mean 2.0L or less. Anything bigger than 2.0L should do very fine
with regular dino oils, unless driven in extreme conditions, that is very
high,
or low, temperatures, towing, long distance high-speed driving, etc.

Observe proper oil viscosities per your car manual, and use only good
oil filters (Subaru/Purolator). The 4000 miles oil change interval sounds
OK, given your driving style/conditions.

It seems to me that your somewhat leisurely style of driving combined
with Subarus fairly large and powerful 2.5L engine, would not need
any synthetic oils. You may consider using them discretionally, for
example only in summer when it is very hot, or only in winter if you
live in some extremely cold locality.

I drive a 2000 Subie Impreza 2.2L and have used synthetics exclusevily
since about 250 miles. I drive in a mountainous terrain and the car sees
a lot of high revving so synthetic oil gives a bit more protection.

I would like to suggest that you change your differential fluids
to synthetics - that is front and rear differential. You may do this
at 5,000 miles, or later. There have been numerous reports that
these oils are not only good for the differentials but also pay for
themselves (or the added cost) in fuel savings.

I switched my Impreza to synhtetic differential lube and noticed
a slight improvement in fuel economy, but I wasn't meticulous
at keeping records to give any numbers. It just makes sense especially
in an AWD drive car, to try reduce any friction in the drivetrain as
much as possible- the synthetics are more slippery for sure.

M.J.

 

[Ashton Crusher]

We bought a new OBW last year, the L.L.Bean edition. It's my first new
car in...wait for it...37 years! Everything in between has been
purchased used (don't you just detest "pre-owned"?).

I know that oils have improved greatly and engines have changed a lot
over the years, so thought I'd ask about oil-change intervals for this
vehicle.

We rarely find ourselves in stop and go traffic; we are usually moving
along at 30 to 70 mph with the stop for the occasional stop light/sign.
With that sort of driving, I felt that an oil/filter change every
4,000 miles would be more than adequate. Do list readers agree or
disagree???

Eventually, we will change to sythetic oil and that leads to me second
two questions:

What's the optimal mileage for the switchover. Wait until 10k, 20k,
longer?

And is pure synthetic best or is the petroleum/synthetic mix better. I
have heard a very persuasive argument made for the mix because it
absolutely will not foam whereas the pure synthetic can indeed foam.
And, of course, foam indicates the presence of air and where there is
air, there is no oil and no lubrication.

Thanks,
Gunny

Our shop services hundreds of cars and light trucks. The oil and
filter interval is 6 months or 6000 miles. Many of our vehicles go
well past 200,000 miles on the original engine and transmission.
Tranny's are serviced every 30,000 miles. With rare exception there
is no reason any vehicle needs the oil and filter changed any more
often than that. On my personal vehicles I use Mobile 1 full
synthetic and do my oil and filter at 12 months or 12,000 miles.

 

[pheasant]

On my personal vehicles I use Mobile 1 full
synthetic and do my oil and filter at 12 months or 12,000 miles.

Same schedule as my 86 GL. Still purring like a kitten 20 years and 150k
later with no engine problems. (one pencil eraser size drip about every 4-5
days) but who wants to fix something that minor.

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Eventually, we will change to sythetic oil and that leads to me second
two questions:

I'd say forget about the synthetics, stick with regular old dino oil.

Yousuf Khan

 

[psyktek]

'85 Saab 900 Turbo, 314K miles, dino juice every 3000 miles since I got
the car in 1995 (with 175K on it), no leaks, no burning. Switched to
synthetic blend (whatever's on sale) 6000K ago, still no leaks or
burning.

my .02 worth.

Bob